MovieChat Forums > General Discussion > Slavery wasn't about race

Slavery wasn't about race


We never hear about class privlidge. All we hear about is white privlidge, how whites should feel guilty for enslaving blacks. Slavery wasn't white versus black. If anything it was rich white versus poor white. Rich whites brought the slaves over so they wouldn't have to pay poor whites for labor. Slavery destroyed the value of labor. It was like union busting.

Blacks were already slaves in Africa, enslaved by other blacks and brought over by Jewish merchants. It wasn't good for blacks either way, and you can't expect white people to solve all the world's problems. Even so, whites did end slavery, long before Africans did. Whites were consistently less cruel, as masters, and especially today, conditions in America are far superior to conditions in Africa, for the decendents of slaves.

Less than 2% of whites owned slaves at its height. As a "nation of immigrants", most whites in America today didn't even come here until after slavery. White people need to stop feeling guilty and start getting angry. All the establishment figures wrote about how white workers were the real enemy.

reply

I agree with everything you said, bar some things I haven't confirmed, such as Jewish merchants or which race was more cruel, or your 2% figure.

I would also add that the first black settlers came to America as indentured servants, just like the Irish. Both races got a horrible deal, but the rumor is that the Irish were treated worse due to being 10x less expensive, and thus easier to replace. Many black people who were indentured servants did gain their freedom, and some in fact went on to become slave owners themselves.

In my view, slavery in all its forms is an atrocity, whether it's done to blacks, Irish, or any other race, including Biblical slavery.

reply

Oh, I will say one more thing. It did eventually shift to race...

reply

I’m in agreement with your statements except for labeling the Irish as a race. They are a Nationality...not a race.

reply

Back then they were not considered white, so there was definitely a racial component.

reply

Well, you gave me information that was news to me. And I’m Irish! I freely admit I was ignorant about this era in American history. I had always heard about the dirty drunken Irish label, but not about us being considered not white. Good Grief! Most of the Irish are whiter than white in appearance. I would call it bigotry though...not racism. Bigotry has always been rampant in this nation and there was a time when true racism occurred. But today most of what we hear and see is bigotry. As I wrote before, Archie Bunker types are bigots. Hitler was a racist through and through.

reply

Are you saying you were raised in Ireland? Because I would think an Irish person could tell you all about it.

reply

No, I wasn’t raised in Ireland. Since you are so officious I should have let it be known I’m of Irish descent! Great-Grandfather WAS raised in Ireland. His surname was O’Hayre.

reply

I'm just saying, Irish schools teach the history way better than what I've studied.

reply

Anything that I have read indicates that Irish immigrants were treated far worse than African slaves in quite a few instances. For example the Irish were used for jobs such as digging canals and draining swamps where the probability was very high that death from malaria would result. I also find it laughable that every white was granted privilege the second they got off of the boat. My Irish grandmother said that as a teen (Great Depression era) she had to work as a seamstress and was subjected to corporal punishment if her employer felt that she was moving too slow or made an error. It was not until the 1960's at the earliest that Irish and Italian descended people were starting to be accepted into society. German-Americans took a big step backward after WWI and were looked at with big mistrust during WWII. Life might have been grand for descendants of the Brits generations ago but for many others only marginally better than the old country they left.

reply

You need to prove what you wrote....otherwise someone will call you out! 😏🙄

reply

What is proof anymore? If an account does not fit a narrative then it is discredited. I guess that we need time traveling ships to go back and see these things. Anyways, things such as the Irish digging canals can be found on the net. As far as the poor treatment of Italian and Irish Americans back during the 20th Century probably many today can recall the stories of their grandparents and great grandparents. A time when in every town each ethnicity had their own baker, butcher, cobbler, and down the line. A time when a Brit descended banker in that same town charged more interest to Irish and Italian business people versus preferred Northern European types (excluding the Irish) such as the Dutch and Danes.

reply

Not necessarily proof, but reasoning, which they have provided, and which your posts are often lacking. You simply state a series of subjective opinions without feeling the duty to defend them with reason OR data. This means you never test your beliefs, and as a result are dumber.

reply

Did you ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe if you ceased slinging the ad hominem attacks...I would have more of a dialogue with you? You are an opinionated, snarky, officious narcissist who doesn’t give someone the option to explain why s/he has those beliefs. Instead the person is dumb. Why? Because the great CarterBlunt knows all! I still think you are a troll attempting to rile those of us you deem beneath you and are foolish to take your bait. You are getting very close to flaming me....just sayin’. The Mods are watching and they react on this board.

reply

[deleted]

Congrats, turns out you can get the mods to censor people here. Enjoy.

reply

You can believe what you will, but I didn’t see your reply which apparently was deleted by a Mod. Our Mods are very discerning in what they deem inappropriate. In other words I didn’t get the Mod to, in your words, “censor people here”.

reply

I am half Irish descent - we are white.

reply

Are you sure?😉 I’m beginning to doubt everything I know. Heck, I may not be from here! The mirror may be lying...can mirrors lie? All that I thought was true I’m being challenged on my beliefs. Is today...today? Or was it yesterday?🤷‍♀️

reply

I agree, and I am Chinese.

reply

Slavery was a phenomenon within a swath of time over many cultures. Even today, people enslave others, although they usually have to do it illegally.

Some day in the future, the history of pollution and environmental destruction will be perceived to be just as evil as slavery is perceived today, if not more so. You and I will be seen as ignorant, lazy barbarians who shat in their own beds.

Yet today, we treat pollution and environmental destruction as "one of those unfortunate things we just can't stop" and I'm sure anti-slavery personas in the past saw slavery in a similar unfortunate light. We even have people who do all they can to dispute and deny any hint of environmental destruction, like modern right-wingers who care more about corporations and industries than they care about the Earth that sustains our lives.

I, for one, still see us as barbarians today, in so many ways. The "gulf" separating us from wild beasts will be merely a footnote to distant future historians, relatively speaking. The reason we are tame and domesticated is still little more than mutual expectations we call civilization.... we wait for the chance to judge others as uncouth and unworthy of society instead of striving to ascend on personal levels, unaffected by the perceptions of others.

What we need to become is a people that value our greater environment the same way we value our bodies and our own lives. We will see no separation between us and others, we will not delineate between our own health and the health of our world and environments (as we will likely be space-faring in this potential future).

But if humanity destroys itself before it gets to this hypothetical point I am describing, then so be it. That will be what needed to be.

reply

I didn’t read this post before cause I was irritated by the op, but you sir are 100% right. This was like reading poetry. Hardly ever discussed because people are so wrapped up in their silly everyday lives and winning arguments on social media.
You are beautiful sir. Much love from one frog to another.

reply

Thank you for your kind words. It's especially significant in this reply because that post was one of a few from that day where I managed to truly express what I felt on an issue in a way that I've struggled to in the past.

Loss of brevity is always my downfall, amazed that I avoided it.

reply

Oh and yes: Conflicts due to class/wealth are pretty much always at the heart of these matters. Things like race simply become additional justifications.

Anyone would struggle to find a "racist" who is still prejudiced against a wealthy upper-class member of the "disfavored race." Locate the most hardcore "anti-black" ideal you can find, and I guarantee they'd be happy to shake the hand of a black billionaire in a tuxedo.

reply

I’m glad you have educated yourself on history, but none of this has to do with the race problems of today. No one is asking white people to feel guilty about slavery, but it is important to acknowledge it happened. I get so irritated at white morons saying “I didn’t own slaves so what does it have to do with me?” It doesn’t.
You’re right, it does have to do with class and money like everything else in America. The issue is that many of the poor people in America are black people. Instead of being angry and hateful, consider the other side of things.
You are a black person born in the ghetto. The education in the majority of poor areas in America sucks. You have a single mother who constantly has to work so you spend the most of your time helping to raise your younger siblings because mom can barely afford rent, much less childcare. You have the option of dropping out of school so you can help mom put food on the table. You are uneducated and poor so you can’t get a job that pays more than minimum wage. You know the only way you will be able to help mom is to start selling drugs because that’s where the money is coming from in the area you live. You have been raised being surrounded by real problems like poverty, drug addictions, aids, poor education...
I’m not saying there is no way to get out of this situation. What I’m saying is, this is where “white privilege” comes in. There is no reason to be angry as a white person, but to act like these issues don’t exist in America is just ignorant. It has nothing to do with slavery. Most of you who complain about this were raised never having to deal with any of the issues that impoverished blacks have had to deal with.
No one is asking whites to solve the worlds problems. It’s not a white/black issue, but it is an American issue. To act like it doesn’t exist because you didn’t grow up that way is just being blind.

reply

Your comments may be true, but Blacks don’t have a lock on being poor. Read my comments on the thread “have you ever eaten Spam?” They don’t come much poorer than whites living in the backwoods.

It’s been proven folks who are in a marriage with children are far less to be in poverty than a mother having several kids and not married. Also, the government in it’s unwise decision to constantly dole out freebies keeps people on that “plantation” be they black, white, Latino, etc. I didn’t vote for Clinton, but he signed a sucessful bill, the “Welfare to Work” legislation. After being on welfare for 2 years folks had to work, or go back to school, receive childcare, etc. It brought people out of generational poverty. Then Obama dismantled the program. Back to the plantation with no initiative to do better.

reply

I completely agree.

reply

The Rock said that’s not what is about dah

reply

I always wondered about slavery but without and references seems you are pulling it out of your arse

reply